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	<title>Comments on: What is &#8220;Fun&#8221;?</title>
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	<description>Developer / Designer / Diviner</description>
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		<title>By: Paolo</title>
		<link>http://www.gamedevigner.com/2009/05/29/what-is-fun/comment-page-1/#comment-310</link>
		<dc:creator>Paolo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Jul 2009 05:01:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gamedevigner.com/?p=472#comment-310</guid>
		<description>A lot of Japanese dating sims are just a simple game of saying the right things at the right time and giving the right presents to get what you want.  It&#039;s all about &quot;scoring points&quot; and saying the right things in the right conversation tree.  In a sense, this really is how a lot of people treat dating and romantic relationships.

But in serious relationships, it&#039;s not just about &quot;you and me&quot;, it&#039;s about &quot;you and my friends&quot;, &quot;you and my family&quot;, &quot;you and the family we are going to build&quot; and &quot;you and my career&quot;, etc.  Talking to some of my friends in college who are in budding relationships they gush all about how romantic, sweet and nice their partner is.  But when asked, &quot;Do you think they would make a good mother/father to your children?&quot;  It&#039;s like they are shocked and put into a different world.  Suddenly, they are put in a different mindset in how to judge a good companion.

A real relationship would be based more on just the simple interactions between the interested parties.  It would be more holistic.  It&#039;s not just about how you talk to and treat your prospect, but other people.  What matters is who you are as a whole person - who you are to everyone around you - not just the facade you put up to win the other person.

In terms of gameplay, there could be multiple solutions to certain obstacles or varying interactions to key characters in the game.  Your choice of solution or interaction can determine how the other people, including a possible companion, view you.  If you respond angrily or violently to solve a certain solution, that could change how you are viewed by other people in the game - resulting in a different relationship with some.  It could be a viable solution to the &quot;sandbox&quot; game morality problem as well - it could make the players behave to get the best relationships.

By the way, you have a great blog and I love your demos!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A lot of Japanese dating sims are just a simple game of saying the right things at the right time and giving the right presents to get what you want.  It&#8217;s all about &#8220;scoring points&#8221; and saying the right things in the right conversation tree.  In a sense, this really is how a lot of people treat dating and romantic relationships.</p>
<p>But in serious relationships, it&#8217;s not just about &#8220;you and me&#8221;, it&#8217;s about &#8220;you and my friends&#8221;, &#8220;you and my family&#8221;, &#8220;you and the family we are going to build&#8221; and &#8220;you and my career&#8221;, etc.  Talking to some of my friends in college who are in budding relationships they gush all about how romantic, sweet and nice their partner is.  But when asked, &#8220;Do you think they would make a good mother/father to your children?&#8221;  It&#8217;s like they are shocked and put into a different world.  Suddenly, they are put in a different mindset in how to judge a good companion.</p>
<p>A real relationship would be based more on just the simple interactions between the interested parties.  It would be more holistic.  It&#8217;s not just about how you talk to and treat your prospect, but other people.  What matters is who you are as a whole person &#8211; who you are to everyone around you &#8211; not just the facade you put up to win the other person.</p>
<p>In terms of gameplay, there could be multiple solutions to certain obstacles or varying interactions to key characters in the game.  Your choice of solution or interaction can determine how the other people, including a possible companion, view you.  If you respond angrily or violently to solve a certain solution, that could change how you are viewed by other people in the game &#8211; resulting in a different relationship with some.  It could be a viable solution to the &#8220;sandbox&#8221; game morality problem as well &#8211; it could make the players behave to get the best relationships.</p>
<p>By the way, you have a great blog and I love your demos!</p>
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		<title>By: axcho</title>
		<link>http://www.gamedevigner.com/2009/05/29/what-is-fun/comment-page-1/#comment-309</link>
		<dc:creator>axcho</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Jul 2009 03:16:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gamedevigner.com/?p=472#comment-309</guid>
		<description>&quot;When it comes to a relationship, everyone loves spending time immersed with one another’s presence, even if it means passively sitting down together and watching a movie.  But no one wants to be made into a “game.”  A game trivializes because it abstracts things into goals and rules – when the goal of a meaningful relationship is simply to “just be with one another.”  Who wants to get into a relationship with an agenda?&quot;

This is an interesting point, and it helps explain why existing games fail to capture the dynamics of friendship. But I still want to try making a game to capture that experience, of companionship! You don&#039;t necessarily have to give it explicit goals...

I wonder what sort of goals and reward structure you can give without taking away from that companionship experience. It may be seen as passive, in contrast with something highly abstract and goal-oriented, such as Tetris. But the sense of companionship gets its meaning from the interaction - without that, the whole thing becomes fiction.

Interesting post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;When it comes to a relationship, everyone loves spending time immersed with one another’s presence, even if it means passively sitting down together and watching a movie.  But no one wants to be made into a “game.”  A game trivializes because it abstracts things into goals and rules – when the goal of a meaningful relationship is simply to “just be with one another.”  Who wants to get into a relationship with an agenda?&#8221;</p>
<p>This is an interesting point, and it helps explain why existing games fail to capture the dynamics of friendship. But I still want to try making a game to capture that experience, of companionship! You don&#8217;t necessarily have to give it explicit goals&#8230;</p>
<p>I wonder what sort of goals and reward structure you can give without taking away from that companionship experience. It may be seen as passive, in contrast with something highly abstract and goal-oriented, such as Tetris. But the sense of companionship gets its meaning from the interaction &#8211; without that, the whole thing becomes fiction.</p>
<p>Interesting post.</p>
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		<title>By: Paolo</title>
		<link>http://www.gamedevigner.com/2009/05/29/what-is-fun/comment-page-1/#comment-194</link>
		<dc:creator>Paolo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jun 2009 16:29:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gamedevigner.com/?p=472#comment-194</guid>
		<description>Thanks Joshua!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Joshua!</p>
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		<title>By: Joshua</title>
		<link>http://www.gamedevigner.com/2009/05/29/what-is-fun/comment-page-1/#comment-193</link>
		<dc:creator>Joshua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jun 2009 09:26:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gamedevigner.com/?p=472#comment-193</guid>
		<description>Really interesting article, Paolo. I like your analysis.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Really interesting article, Paolo. I like your analysis.</p>
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